Curse

racso · Apr 03, 2007, 06:58 AM // 06:58

/signed

Enough was told, however I want to add that in alter holding was more fun because, besides killing, there was a pressure on holding the alter, which adds more challenging to the game.

Mr Jazzy · Apr 03, 2007, 10:00 PM // 22:00

Kill the Kill Count!!

Pretty much agreed.

/Signed

linh · Apr 03, 2007, 10:04 PM // 22:04

3 team Kill Count is just silly and broken. It encourage AoE spam, boa sin to sneak gank and kill as fast as possible.
/signed

Monk Gsb · Apr 03, 2007, 10:15 PM // 22:15

/signed.

anet. does 8 pages of "/signed" prove to you that it needs removing ??

zyphaz · Apr 03, 2007, 10:23 PM // 22:23

/signed

Bring back 6-way!

lauratos landof · Apr 03, 2007, 11:21 PM // 23:21

/signed
1234

UltimaSlash · Apr 04, 2007, 04:24 AM // 04:24

/signed

kill count turns out to be 2v1 and its just ridiculous

Makkert · Apr 04, 2007, 04:31 AM // 04:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by tacitus

/signed

bring back claim resource!

oh yeah. that was an huge succes. let's bring back huge dependancy on a NPC that was so easily bodyblocked and demanded builds to bring specific skills to help that NPC move (i.e. Winbourne in the past) and survive (i.e. seed in the past).

Quote:

Originally Posted by zyphaz

/signed

Bring back 6-way!

haha. that was a good laugh.

fenix · Apr 04, 2007, 04:44 AM // 04:44

Kill Count is stupid, it's just running around in circles for 5 minutes, then ganking a team for 2 minutes. It should be either changed, or removed.

ayame ftw · Apr 04, 2007, 10:33 AM // 10:33

/signed
1234

Liveundead122 · Apr 04, 2007, 04:33 PM // 16:33

/signed

yee

jana_the_stranger · Apr 05, 2007, 09:57 AM // 09:57

/signed

.....

Death_From_Above · Apr 05, 2007, 01:36 PM // 13:36

/signed kill counts just lame *die kill count please and burry yourself somewhere never to be seen again*

Seraphic Divinity · Apr 05, 2007, 01:56 PM // 13:56

I'm going to go out on a limb here... so... feel free to hang me for it if it's stupid, but at least take it into consideration..

/Not Signed

Alright... basically from what I hear is:
-Kill Count is Bad because it promotes spikes

*No, Kill Count does not promote spikes... what promotes spikes is the UW where you -MUST- confront an opposing team.

-Kill Count is Bad because other people steal your kills

*No, other people 'stealing' your kills is not bad. To put it short: Suck Less. If the strategist on your team is unable to effectively observe what monks are being shut down and who's being pressured then you obviously are not in a position to argue about strategy.

-Kill Count is Bad because everyone runs around until one team gets ganked

*No, you put yourself in that situation. Nothing says you have to run around... What is wrong with actually confronting a team and waiting to see how the other team reacts, and -then- dictating further actions. If you ask me, you're all being way to conservative, and that does not win fights alone... what wins battles is taking action -OBSERVING- other teams reactions and responses and based on that making further tactical positioning.

***IMO it's more of a problem with people just -complaining- about it and wanting to be catered to. If you can't suck less, then don't play the game.

Lord Mendes · Apr 05, 2007, 02:43 PM // 14:43

***IMO you're a scrub.

Seraphic Divinity · Apr 05, 2007, 02:50 PM // 14:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lord Mendes

***IMO you're a scrub.

You're feed-back is much appreciated.

Anyhow... aside from completely biased and un-thoughtful cruel remarks, I'm wondering if anyone else vaguely sees where I'm coming from... O_o If not, maybe I just stayed up too late last night and am not quite thinking straight :P

FoxBat · Apr 05, 2007, 03:36 PM // 15:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seraphic Divinity

Anyhow... aside from completely biased and un-thoughtful cruel remarks

Quote:

If you can't suck less, then don't play the game.

Something about Pot, Kettle, Black?

Anyway, I say Kill Count sucks because you only fight for the last 2 minutes. That's almost as bad as old altar holding and needs to go.

There's a number of things discouraging shutdown in HA. Kill count is one of them, DPless rezes on the minute in HoH is the other.

stuntharley · Apr 05, 2007, 03:48 PM // 15:48

/signed

Pressure is so much more fun... it makes bringing panic and energy degen hexes worth it.

Spikes and AoE are ZzZzZ

Rust In Peace · Apr 05, 2007, 04:44 PM // 16:44

/signed
12......

Divineshadows · Apr 05, 2007, 04:52 PM // 16:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seraphic Divinity

*No, Kill Count does not promote spikes... what promotes spikes is the UW where you -MUST- confront an opposing team.

I'm amazed at the ignorance. There are much more reliable ways to ensure victory on the first map than to play spike. Historically, teams in HA could load up on a bunch of anti-spike and anti-melee counters and run a pressure build (that has the potential to call spikes as well of course).

You have to be quite blind to not see that kill count does promote spike. Three way kill count rewards the team that can kill first (double points) and rewards teams that can kill from range (i.e. ranged spike) and don't require getting up close and personal (w/ warriors and dervishes). Why is this? Because the further you have to press into an enemy team, the further your distance in an escape to avoid being collapsed upon when you see a double team coming your way. This basically means that you have to have even more foresight/forethought to avoid the double teams when playing a build that is not a ranged spike.

To further complicate the matter, it's non-trivial to consistently (95+ % of the time) disrupt a single opposing team's spike but to do so against two spike teams using a balanced build is nigh impossible (cause the spike teams rarely have enough good anti-spike tools to disrupt). The solution? Play a balanced build and hope to rely on superior positioning (i.e. if you're not in cast/bow range you can't be spiked) and facing two bad spike teams that fail at positioning. The other solution? Play a spike build and hope to just spike faster than the other two spike teams. This is the safer option for teams that contain bad players.

As much as kill count sucks, it's still better than altar holding because it doesn't force overly defensive builds.

/signed - to remove kill count but not to replace it with altar holding (at least not on both maps -- Broken Tower and Courtyard)